0 Votes
RE: Crusader Mentality
So the Crusades had nothing to do with Muslim aggression into Europe mixed in with some religious extremism of their own? Of course it was all the groups fault of whom you don’t like.
I know, I’ve been away a while, been busy with work and too lazy to post.
First off, it’s the secular politically correct crap that’s been damaging the military for years that lead to Major Hasan’s shooting rampage.
I’m not sure how many of you here are or were in the military, because I have been enlisted for 10 years now.
Commissioned Officers are required to obtain and retain a Secrete Clearance to first receive their commission and promote up the ranks. This is from an FBI press release on 09NOV09.
http://www.fbi.gov/pressrel/pressrel09/forthood111109.htm
“Major Hasan came to the attention of the FBI in December 2008 as part of an unrelated investigation being conducted by one of our Joint Terrorism Task Forces (JTTFs).”
With the FBI being aware of Hasan and his outspoken stance on the war because of Islam and his poor OERs, Hasan should have been stripped of his secrete clearance and his commission at least a 11 months before the shooting. But due to political correctness, which has no place in the military, people were afraid to do their job and deal with the enemy from within. They didn’t want an EO complaint against them or a civil lawsuit for “religious discrimination” when the jerk off wasn’t qualified to retain his secrete clearance.
And you’re griping about the Oath of Enlistment and the Bible verse on the ACOG?
First off, who gives a crap about what the Supreme Court declares ceremonial when the Founders clearly wrote Natures God in the Declaration of Independence?
Anyone who buys into the ceremonial crap and wants to eliminate religion completely from any government reference goes against the founding of this country and the intents of the founders.
It’s funny, I have two very good friends who are pagan and they actually thought the verse markings on the ACOG were cool. I personally don’t care. I love the ACOG because it is a great piece of equipment and if there were any markings that “offended” me I would scratch them and tell my supply sergeant I slipped and fell on some rocks during training.
Why don’t you leave the opinion poles up to we Soldiers?
As for eliminating the Chaplain Corps? That’s one of the stupid notions I’ve ever heard. The military deems service members are entitled to religious guidance and the free practice thereof for their morale as most humans are spiritual in some form or fashion. Also, there are often times when a Soldier will only speak to a Chaplain about certain problems because they want to confidentiality that only a Chaplain can bring.
It’s not disturbing, it’s not a real issue except with people who hate religion. Most Soldiers and people in the United States are religious, deal with it.
RE: Crusader Mentality by scottb
So the Crusades had nothing to do with Muslim aggression into Europe mixed in with some religious extremism of their own? Of course it was all the groups fault of whom you don’t like.
I’d say the Crusades had a lot more to do with Europe needing a way to get rid of some unwanted younger nobility than Muslim aggression, which provided a convenient excuse.
First off, it’s the secular politically correct crap that’s been damaging the military for years that lead to Major Hasan’s shooting rampage.
You seem to be confusing “secular politically correct crap” with religious politically correct crap. A proper secular army would have told Hasan to shut his damn mouth much sooner, and would have relieved him of his commission if he didn’t. It’s because religious groups demand preferential treatment for their nonsense that it didn’t.
First off, who gives a crap about what the Supreme Court declares ceremonial when the Founders clearly wrote Natures God in the Declaration of Independence?
I do. The Declaration of Independence has nothing to do with our government. The principal author of the document’s text, Thomas Jefferson, was a Deist, who rejected the divinity of Jesus. He spent most of his public life fighting against religious influence on government. The three accomplishments of which he was most proud were the Declaration of Independence, the Statute of Virginia for Religious Freedom, and founding the University of Virginia.
It’s Jefferson’s thinking that largely informs the Supreme Court’s interpretation of the establishment clause of the first amendment to the Constitution.
The Constitution… now that has a lot to do with our government. One might be tempted to say it’s the whole foundation of our government. And yet, there’s not a single mention of gods anywhere in the thing.
America is not a “Christian nation”. It just happens to have a lot of people who believe that particular flavor of nonsense.
Anyone who buys into the ceremonial crap and wants to eliminate religion completely from any government reference goes against the founding of this country and the intents of the founders.
Quite the contrary. The founders seemed quite determined that religion not have any influence over government, and its those who seek to tear down the wall of separation that go against their intentions.
Why don’t you leave the opinion poles up to we Soldiers?
Because that’s not the role of soldiers. The military is part of a government that gets its authority from “we the people”. Soldiers are a small fraction of the people, and one whose distinguishing trait is that they’ve agreed to follow orders from a chain of command, the top of which is “we the people”, expressed through our designated representative.
Note that those orders included General Order #1, which specifically prohibits proselytization, and the bible verses on the guns are a clear violation of that order.
The military deems service members are entitled to religious guidance and the free practice thereof for their morale as most humans are spiritual in some form or fashion.
People are entitled to marry and have children if they want, yet the military doesn’t provide spouses and fertility treatments.
Moreover, it’s simply false that “only a Chaplain can bring” the confidentiality they seek. They can get religious guidance (including the confidentiality) the same way everyone else does, by visiting a civilian.
Even in war zones there are plenty of civilians hanging around to provide necessary community services that the military doesn’t. Journalists are a prime example. Citizens back home need the information they provide, and it would be entirely inappropriate for the military to be the sole provider of it, so civilian journalists are sent—at private expense—to do the job. Religious fleecing services can be provided the same way.
Most Soldiers and people in the United States are religious, deal with it.
Soldiers, taken as a group, are less religious than the general population. Only about 15% of the general population self-identifies as non-religious, while about 20% of soldiers do.
Unfortunately, they show a similar pattern when it comes to the more fundamentalists forms of Christianity—again, only about 15% of the general population go in for it, while about 20% of soldiers do.
While it’s true that “most people” in the US and the military self-identify as belonging to some religion, it’s not entirely clear that most of them are “religious” in any more than a nominal sense.
I do hate religion. It’s been a cancer on American society since its inception. But one doesn’t expect the cancer to recognize that it’s harmful.
And I am dealing with it, the only ethical way. Like so many others, I’m standing up and reminding everyone who’ll listen that it’s unsupported bullshit. And guess what? It seems to be working. In 1990, only about 5% of the general population self-identified as non-religious.
Deal with it.