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RE: The troops in Iran & Afghanistan
Or we could assume that there are a lot of sensible people in the world who still look to America for leadership, but who would like to listen to and contribute to the debate. If our case is strong it will stand up to this sort of examination. America is not the only country going to the aid of peoples in distress. and/or making a botch of it.
This is a very difficult thing to do well, and we should encourage others to advise us. For example, the Australians, in East Timor, Papua New Guinea, and the Solomon Islands seem to have a superior way of managing these things with their military and police contingents. Even in Afghanistan, they seem to be getting on better with the local popuation and minimising their causualties while still participating indangerous operations.
Our differences of opinion have been well established in previous debate. I agree with you that the effect of our intervention has been to put off a murderous retaliation against the Iraquis who we have supported and who have supported us. That is the essence of our dilemma. How long will Americans be prepared to go on making the sacrifices that they have been making for the last three years. I suspect not for many more years, and then the retaliation will happen anyway.
There has never, ever been in Iraq or Afghanistan a moderate government that America would be happy with, so any attempt to make one now would require vastly more resources than Congress would ever be prepared, or capable of, allocating. I am sure you have seen the analysis of this proposition by Prof Hugh White I recently posted elsewhere on this forum
I suspect that being an anti-war activist in America is far from being a childish or safe preoccupation. Blocking transport is the most common form of protest in France because it forces everyone to think about the issues. It may be infuriating but it is effective in attracting attention. As you say mere ranting would be totally ineffective, and the protesters are not stupid. They may even be very patriotic people who are trying to help this coutry to get out of a very bad situation that mindless "partiotic" support for very the poor foreign policyof the present Administration has gotten us into.
A country like ours ought to be able to handle such a trivial protest peacefully - without silly vitriol, and without causing any harm to our wor effort. It is a symbolic tactic and symbols are merely token mental props, having only the meaning that we allow them to have.
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RE: The troops in Iran & Afghanistan
Is your logic about only vets having the right to oppose the war based on their experience giving them a superior insight, or is it that their service grants them a right to object by removing any doubts about cowardice?
That would be neither. Just as intellectually lazy people throw out the "chicken hawk" appellation to avoid actual debate, so would the reverse. What I was referring to in my post is the abject childishness and supreme arrogance of these war protesters who go beyond carrying their stupid signs and chanting their vacuous slogans (which is their right) to actively attempting to undermine the war effort by blocking military shipments. I have a hard time distinguishing their "protests" from enemy sabotage.
but let's hear from all Americans, and the world, about whether we should stay there.
Yes, let's listen to the "world" which has shown time and time again it's collective willingness to abandon any people to death and chaos for the sake of political expediency, or to give the US a black eye and go "nyah nyah na nyah!" Or, we could listen to the Iraqis who are increasingly taking control of their country... naaah, they're a bunch of stupid A-rabs, Europe know what's best for them, and that would be death squads and religious tyranny.
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