Add a Comment
Email This
Statistics
Out spending the Russians is another valid point but I suspect that there were many other factors to the collapse of the Russian economy -you know, all that stuff about the dead hand of socialism and the benefits of the invisible hand of free markets.
Yeah, that's why out-spending them worked. My larger point was the massive military build-up sans a hot war, with no end in sight didn't bankrupt us. Also, some of us think the Cold War Reagan-era military build up was because Reagan knew what the hell he was doing, but I can see how some people would want to denigrate the accomplishments of the best president of the last half of the 20th century.
Is it not reasonable to ask questions about how much the out spending tactic will hurt ordinary Americans?
Except we aren't trying to out-spend anyone this time around. We're fighting two-- count'em -- two counter-insurgency wars using highly trained, technologically-savvy personnel (which costs more than just grabbing conscripts off the street, like in China). It costs money. How will the spending hurt ordinary Americans? Odds are, it won't. Like most things about this war, it won't affect the vast majority of Americans (probably, again, I'm no economist, but I am a thinker.) Which, in the opinion of someone who was affected by the war, tends to make the bitching of people who have never sacrificed a damn thing or likely ever will ring a little hollow, but I try not to think like that, as it skews too close to the stupid "chicken-hawk" non-argument.
I am afraid that the rest of your response was the usual off target emotional and personal personal rant - quite unworthy of omnes nerdi. I did not say we should pull out of Iraq this time. I gave an opinion that our presence was sustaining terrorists. I know you don't agree with that because we have discussed it before. It is relevant in this discussion because we are discussing a drain on the American economy as a possible strategy of the terrorists.
Let me see, I gave examples of how the Anbar tribes are uniting against terrorism, mentioned rebuilding infrastructure, and addressed the economic angle. Yup, entirely off- target, you got me. As for the personal... you do realize the opening paragraph was a joke, right? I mean, I even said it was. I also never said anything about a pull out (since you didn't.) It is possible that the enemy has an economic strategy (I believe that one was called 9/11) but the main strategy of the terrorists is to keep US body-counts in the news (since they know our media tend to not report things like enemy casualties or any sort of operational context in which American casualties occurred) because they know that if the American people are fed a steady diet of bad news, the opportunistic politicians will start blathering on about timetables and troop withdrawals, and all the terrorists have to do is wait us out and make sure to step up attacks right before any important dates, and then declare victory when we leave. But you knew that.
Our arming of the Sunnis to fight the insurgents is about the dumbest piece of policy that any US Government has come up with since the Little Big Horn.
Okay, I looked through the links provided, and I never found anything about us arming Sunnis. I know I didn't mention it. The Sunnis have their own arms-- that's why they were/are often part of the insurgency.
The impact of the war on the economy of Iraq is irrelevant.
Maybe to this discussion, but the more Iraqis that can find work and earn some money, the less likely some poor schlub will be out planting IEDs because Al Qaeda or Al Sadr is paying him to. Economic prosperity tends to encourage stability.
I think we are mature enough to handle that without personal abuse.
No abuse on my part, just a healthy dose of snark. Impervious Integument Implied.
Sorry, my login must have timed out. That Anonymous post was of course me.
I did not realise that Dilly was joking as it seemed quite consistent with his other posts.
RSS
RE: Full of Sound and Fury, Signifying Nothing.
Thanks Dill
First Let me congratulate you for an apt, but humble and self deprecating title for your post.
The purpose of the topic is to gather opinions on how close the war is taking us to our economic collapse. You have given one, and your point about Vietnam is valid. Government spending even on weapons can boost the economy for a short time but debt tends to catch up eventually. It would be useful to know how robust the rest of our economy was in the late 1960s, and what effect the Vietnam war had on inflation and the stock market in the early 1970s, which was a volatile era. Perhaps someone can enlighten us.
Out spending the Russians is another valid point but I suspect that there were many other factors to the collapse of the Russian economy -you know, all that stuff about the dead hand of socialism and the benefits of the invisible hand of free markets.
Some of us believe that the out spending on the military during the Reagan years had more to do with the selfish interests of the military industrial complex having undue influence on an almost senile President.
Is it not reasonable to ask questions about how much the out spending tactic will hurt ordinary Americans?
The idea of readiness for a war being measured in terms of the potential available in the economy to respond to the financial demands is as old as Sun Tzu. It should be the first thing that a government thinks about.
On the trivia:
I was referring to Iraq -a quintessentially Arab country. Sure, there are probably other ethnic groups represented among the terrorists, but it would be awfully pedantic to give them all credits in a piece like this. I still prefer to blame Arab culture more than Islam, but that is just me. That is a topic that has already been well thrashed out with Will. Of course there is a strong relationship, but if you want precision blaming Islam captures more of the uninvolved than "Arabs".
I am afraid that the rest of your response was the usual off target emotional and personal personal rant - quite unworthy of omnes nerdi. I did not say we should pull out of Iraq this time. I gave an opinion that our presence was sustaining terrorists. I know you don't agree with that because we have discussed it before. It is relevant in this discussion because we are discussing a drain on the American economy as a possible strategy of the terrorists.
Our arming of the Sunnis to fight the insurgents is about the dumbest piece of policy that any US Government has come up with since the Little Big Horn. Even the French were not that stupid. Anyhow it is quite off topic and you are leading me off target again. This thread is about the economic effects of the War on America.
The impact of the war on the economy of Iraq is irrelevant. I imagine that after Saddam and our intervention it had nowhere to go but up anyway, and if it has, that is consistent with my pressure cooker metaphor. Which does not mean that you or I are right there.
Perhaps America is not close to the edge. I certainly hope not, as I am intending to live on superannuation for a long time.
We have not been in quite the same situation as this before, and it is worth thinking about in terms of an economic model as well as in the usual armchair general manner.
I think we are mature enough to handle that without personal abuse.
View Full Discussion