Add a Comment
Email This
Statistics
Not a Zero-Sum Game
Good take. Just a quick answer before I begin dismantling :) your various points at a later time: I truly doubt this is a zero-sum game, just like the increase in population did not bring the feared mass starvation various pre-industrial revolution folks predicted. You could also argue, speaking of stereotypes, that 'not-so-skilled-and-perhaps-not-as-smart' illegal immigrants make rather good, healty replacements for the hords of crystal-meth consuming rednecks out there. I will leave the stereotypes aside, though, because they dilute the value of my (and your) points.
I guess what bothers me are the knee-jerk reactions by individuals (via emails, comments, public jeers), local governments (see Oklahoma, Herndon and Reston, VA), and the apparent unwillingness of the federal institutions to tackle this issue at all (and when they will, I hope they will do it rationally and in the spirit of tolerance and acceptance that made America the lighthouse of the developing world).
RE: Chose B
I want to comment on the apparent burden put on the hospital system. I argue this is no one's fault in particular. If you think about it, you enjoy cheaper food and cheaper services because the immigrants (illegal or not) are paid less. Therefore, at a philosophical level it seems 'right and fair' for the very same workers who served you well with their hard labor to enjoy "some" benefits of this rich society.
I can easily point out several instances where arguably the public money is blatantly wasted (the cruise ships and trailer homes after Katrina come to mind, and arguably some of the military endeavors of the past decades could be seen as a drain on tax payer's money [[arguably!!! -- please don't jump all at once and destroy me for this comment]]).
RE: Chose B
Vnut,
I think your reasons for letting them in are spot on. America is such a great place that most of us never need to find out much about the rest of the world. We assume that it is all inferior to our world, and so do don't rate it as important.
We get by fine like that until we try to express an opinion about some global matter.
Sometimes even our opinions of very American matters show that we have no idea or interest in how these problems have been handled in other countries.
RE: Chose B
I would like to address hospital care as well. I too wanted to help everyone and save the world, but after working in a hospital I've become jaded. I agree that illegals do spend our money and take away services from others who are citizens that are in need. However, I have MANY patients who are homeless, non tax paying, non contributing to soceity, "citizens" that pay nothing for their hospital stay, admitted because they drank 2 bottles of vodka one day and burned a hole straight through their esophagus. Just a bed in our facility - no medications included costs close to $1,000 daily. The aforementioned individual stayed with us for 2 months before being discharged back to the street. Illegals are only a part of the problem with our hospital/insurance system and this deserves a larger forum for discussion. If an illegal, visiting foreigner or homeless person wants to come in to my hospital and pay fee for service - bring 'em on in! Should healthcare only be available for those who can afford it? I'm beginning to think, yes.
RE: Chose B
I would like to address hospital care as well. I too wanted to help everyone and save the world, but after working in a hospital I've become jaded. I agree that illegals do spend our money and take away services from others who are citizens that are in need. However, I have MANY patients who are homeless, non tax paying, non contributing to soceity, "citizens" that pay nothing for their hospital stay, admitted because they drank 2 bottles of vodka one day and burned a hole straight through their esophagus. Just a bed in our facility - no medications included costs close to $1,000 daily. The aforementioned individual stayed with us for 2 months before being discharged back to the street. Illegals are only a part of the problem with our hospital/insurance system and this deserves a larger forum for discussion. If an illegal, visiting foreigner or homeless person wants to come in to my hospital and pay fee for service - bring 'em on in! Should healthcare only be available for those who can afford it? I'm beginning to think, yes.
RSS
Chose B
I've been thinking about this one for awhile and I choose option B. There is something to be said for America's existence, success and focus being based upon a history of ethnic diversity. And I agree that this should continue. But first, a little devil's advocate - why should the immigrants stay home?
Homogenizing ourselves with the status quo still leaves us pretty diverse ...
... but, it cuts off the influx of new ideas and innovations. On the flip side, it could definitely be argued that we've opened ourselves up for picking. Let me generalize a bit with some stereotypes. Are we really getting a lot of innovation or revolutionary ideas from illegal immigrants south of the border? It's easy to argue that landscaping crews and field workers offer nothing intellectual to America other than somebody else's body to wear out on manual labor. Are we really getting a lot of innovation or revolutionary ideas from immigrants on student/work visas (e.g. China & India)? This one is more vague. Obviously a lot of brilliant immigrants have done great things working in industry. However, America has lost a lot of industrial secrets and corporate strategies when those immigrants return home and take the idea with them to a cheaper labor market. (Yes, Americans sell out too ...) I'm sure American kids that did not make it to college because someone on a student visa took their slot and then returned home were pretty pissed. That about sums up the reasons I know that most people are feeling negative on immigration.
Oh, I almost forgot hospital care. Now my wife is about as "save-the-world" as they get. But after she started riding as an EMT with the local ambulance corps, even she has become peeved at the hospital system providing tax funded care to illegals. 1) NJ has some pretty high taxes and 2) it means the ambulance and hospital staff is tied up when a call for an actual citizen may come in.
But what about reasons to keep on letting immigrants in?
Americans in general are pretty stupid. We're very naive. Many don't even travel more than 100 miles from home in their lifetime. We live in our little towns and see/know the people that live around us. We call ourselves culturally diverse because we live in a country that is diverse ... but our scope of experience is NOT diverse.
Now I'm not saying the Europe is the all-knowing sage of culture, no matter what the French think. And most people can get along fine in their lives without having any idea what people are like in Africa, Asia or the Middle East.
But when they come here, it sure makes people's eyes open. And it really does force Americans to understand what it means to be part of a global community so long as they don't let their biases/prejudices cloud their eyes. The reality is - sure, your ancestors were Irish, African or Chinese or whatever more than a century ago. But that doesn't make YOU Irish, African or Chinese.
All this I've just written is rather discombobulated and stream-of-consciousness. But I wanted to throw some thoughts into the mix without just being a non-participating reader.
View Full Discussion